Pics of my new Boaphile cage

[surfimp]

As promised, here we go: a few pictures of the new Boaphile Plastics cage that Mr. Ronne built me.

It's pretty sweet, in my humble opinion: 48" wide x 29" deep x 24" tall, with a 21" deep shelf about 14" off the cage floor.

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/cage01.jpg

It also has an expandable end, with a smaller "door" than the standard expandables, to accomodate the shelf:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/expand01.jpg

I built a shelf out of a standard 32" wide x 80" long solidcore door and some heavy-duty shelf supports, the cage goes up on that, with room for supplies beneath:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/setup01.jpg

All in all, I'm really stoked! I'm going to be experimenting with different heating setups, and once I get it all "wired" (pun intended), I'll be asking the kindly Mr. Ronne to send me out one of his babies to take up residence! :)

[surfimp]

Okay, here's some more pictures of my new Boaphile cage. After trying out a piece of 11" wide x 24" long Flexwatt and not getting very good results, I went out and got a couple Sunbeam Health at Home "King Size" human heat pads (12" x 24"). They gave me a lot better results (the Flexwatt couldn't even heat the bare cage floor above about 88*...whats up with that?).

Here's a picture of the heat pad installation:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/heatpads.jpg

The duct tape is there more to hold the pads in position while I lift & lower the cage than anything else. I have the pads set on the highest setting and am controlling them using a Helix Controls DBS-1000, which provides proprotional power so I'm not worried about overheating. Initial tests are looking good--max surface temperature on the bare plastic floor gets to about 93*F, and will probably be a bit lower with a couple layers of newspaper on top (that's what I'm testing now) :)

Okay, and now for my question: Up top, I have a Helix Controls medium size (100 watt) radiant heat panel, whose heated surface is 8" off the floor of the shelf. When installing the panel, I used 3" stainless steel machine screws with nylon locknuts, but there's about 1/2" or so of screw protruding below the face of the panel, as you can see in this picture:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/helixpanel.jpg

Does this look unsafe to anybody? Should I worry about this? It's not a big deal to go out and try to find some 2 1/2" or 2 3/4" screws, it's just that the hardware store I went to didn't have that option...only 2" or 3". I could also invert the screws so that the threaded end would go out the top, and only the screw head would be in the cage. Any suggestions?

[The_Boaphile]

Just one suggestion. I never use the human heating pads above the medium setting. I'd try it on this setting and after some period of hours check and see if your temps are what you are looking for. I would think that with the 100 watt radiant panel plus the "king sized" human heating pads you may have all the heat you need and more. Just give it a try.

Thanks for posting the valuable info and trying a little of this and a little of that.

[surfimp]

Jeff, thanks for the reply. Upon reflection, I guess if my Helix thermostat ever conked out, I'd probably rather have the the human heat pads set on medium than high...thanks for the advice. I'm trying the heat pads setup on "medium", we'll see how that works out.

In any event, here is a photograph of my current setup and the temperatures that I've been able to attain and maintain with it:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/heating.jpg

In case the above isn't very clear, here's a rundown:


Ambient room temperature: 75ºF

Shelf hot side, 1" above floor, 8" below Helix radiant heat panel: 95ºF

Shelf cold side, 1" above floor, no direct heat: 84ºF

Floor hot side, 1" above floor heated by human heat pads set on "High": 90ºF

Floor cold side, 1" above floor, no direct heat: 80ºF

"Ambient" cage temperature, in between floor and shelf, middle of the cage: 82ºF

All heating elements are being controlled by a Helix Controls DBS-1000 with probe centered underneath the heat panel, 1" off shelf floor, and approx. 7" below the radiant heat panel.

Temperature on the DBS-1000 is set to 92ºF.


I have a space heater keeping the room warm, however at this time it is NOT running through any sort of thermostat--it's only using it's internal thermostat. I think that I'm going to invest in another Helix controller for it as well, and possibly a window A/C unit, because this room unfortunately tends to get very warm on summer afternoons and I don't want to think what would happen if I wasn't here to open a door/window--would probably just get a little too warm (like ambient room temp in the high 80ºs), but I'd hate to be wrong.

I'd love any and all feedback on the above items. I'll also report back about how well the "Medium" setting worked for my human heat pads. I may need to up the room's ambient temperature slightly, which isn't the end of the world but this room is also my home office (and I work at home so I'm in here all the time) so I'm trying to keep the room's ambient below 80 if possible.

Thanks again Jeff!

[surfimp]

Just another follow-up to the above--having the human heat pads set on "medium" appears to be working out just fine. Temps are currently 89*F hot / 79*F cold; ambient room temp has dropped to 73*F, so I guess that's okay. I'll check it in the morning and through tomorrow, but tentatively it's looking like there's no difference in heating effectiveness between the "Medium" and "High" settings, when using the Helix stat to control temperatures. At least I hope so ;)

[surfimp]

Okay, a follow up to the follow up:

The Sunbeam 'Health at Home' King-Size human heat pads seem to be working just fine on the "medium" setting. One item to note about these pads: anyone will tell you that they're not meant for "always-on" applications like reptile heating, and for that reason you need to be careful with them...I installed a smoke detector above my cage setup and am planning on replacing the heat pads every two years or so, just as a preventative measure.

Next: the space heater I'm currently using (a Heat Stream Alert 3000) is just one I had lying around; I'm going to replace it with an oil-filled radiator version (probably by DeLonghi, by default, since that's really the only thing I can find) and this heater will be controlled by a 1500W Helix Controls thermostat, which I ordered today. I think I may be starting to go overboard with this whole cage setup thing, but when you come to think about it, how much is peace of mind really worth? The "thermostat" on my current space heater leaves much to be desired, and I certainly wouldn't feel good leaving it unsupervised for a couple days--I'd be worried the whole time that I:

a) cooked my snake;
b) burned down the house; or
c) all of the above

In any event, the way I rationalize it to myself is that "someday", when I've got more reptiles in a dedicated herp room, I'll be able to use the same equipment to good effect and will thus avoid some costs down the road. At least that's what I tell myself. From the movie Memento: "Do I tell myself lies so that I can be happy? Yes, in this case I think I will".

So by the time I get done fooling around with all this heating stuff, Jeff's mama's are hopefully going to be dropping some sweet little slithering bundles of joy. I can hardly wait! cwm32.gif

[morti]

You have definately gone all out on the enclosure! I wish a couple of things...
a) Everyone would take the time to research the needs of they animals they are keeping before they get them like you have
and
b) I could afford about 12 of the setup you just discribed. :-)

[surfimp]

Thanks morti :)

I had a bad experience once long ago with my first Colombian boa, and afterwards I vowed that I would never get another animal until I knew as much as I possibly could about the proper care and husbandry of the animal in question. I've held myself to that, and it's taken about 12 years, but finally I'm back!

I've only gone as far as I have with the cage setup because I really don't see any other way that I could keep an animal to the generally accepted standards for the species, and be 100% positive that I was doing so. Not to say that other people's setups aren't totally acceptable, but, for me, this is really about the only way I could figure out to "do it right".

I think the big breakthrough for me, however, was the realization that you basically have to heat an entire room to effectively maintain the required temperatures for healthy reptiles. Once you nail that, the rest comes pretty easily, and I'm sure this is true whether you're using glass aquaria, melamine, or plastic as your enclosure medium.

Using thermostats was really the only way I could figure out how to a) maintain proper temperature in the enclosure; and b) maintain proper temperature in the room housing the enclosure.

My SOHO (Snake Optimized Home Office) didn't come with any heat vents or zone control thermostats built-in, so the Helix Controls setup is actually the most cost-effective way of *safely* maintaining temperature in my SOHO without relying on the highly sketchy 'stat on the space heater. If it seems like I need it for the summer months, like I said I'll add either a small window A/C unit, or perhaps a blower fan to cool the room off.

I just feel like it's my responsibility to take the best possible care of my pet that I'm able to. Not knowing any better, I did it the "wrong" way once--unheated room, wild caught animal, etc, etc--and ended up with a dead pet and a serious case of heartburn. This time around I'm trying to do it better. But I tell you what--it ain't cheap! ;)

[surfimp]

As I'm sure many of you may have experienced, my significant other was not very impressed with the idea of keeping frozen rodents in our freezer. So much so that I've had to go out and acquire a second, smaller freezer for the express purpose of maintaining my future frozen feeder population.

Here are some pictures of the model that I got. It's a 3.0 cubic foot Galaxy chest-style freezer available from Sears:

The outside:
http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/freezer01.jpg

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/freezer02.jpg
http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/freezer03.jpg

And the inside. How many rats you think I can fit in there, Mr. Ronne? ;)

Anyways, a pretty good solution for my rodent keeping needs.

[redtailboas]

Awesome work Steve. Very detailed explanations. I hope it works extremely well for you. You have created an ideal environment for the boas.

As morti said, all I need is about 20 of those setups ;D

I have not had any problems with the flexwatt applications and I have to have mine dimmer controlled and cannot ever set them on full because they get too hot. One problem with the flex watt is the electrical connection to the heat tape has to make consistent and firm contact. Sometimes the clips they provide do no make great contact.

By the way, that freezer will hold a TON of RATS RATS RATS!

My rat order from Jeff is due in today! About 300 stinkin rats!!!!!!!

[surfimp]

Thanks for the encouragement, Clay :) I posted a somewhat streamlined version of the above thread over on your forum as well, hopefully it will benefit others trying to set up their cages, be they Boaphile Plastics, aquaria, or whatever. (It would've been longer but I kept running into the "post too long" error, so I had to trim it down a bit) :)

I think I just got a funky piece of Flexwatt. It came from Helix Controls and they soldered the connectors on for me, but for some reason it just never heated up like it seems like it's supposed to. Since neither Flexwatt or human heat pads are truly "meant" for this sort of application, I'm sort of undecided about which I think is safer to use...it is nice that the human heat pads at least come with the three position setting so that you have some (probably minor) control over the theoretical maximum heat output, should the master thermostat (Helix in my case) ever crap out in the "on" position. Like I think I said above, I'm just planning on replacing the heat pads every two years or so, in an effort to try to be on the "safe side". And I installed a smoke detector directly above my cage setup, just in case.

Another idea I had the other day: has anyone ever tried using fiberglass insulation to insulate a cage? For example, take a standard BP cage and put 2" insulation on the sides, back and top of the cage, and then put a 1/2" plywood "shell" around that. You'd of course leave the front uncovered so that you'd have access to the door, and so that animal inside would have ventilation. I dunno, it just seemed like it might be a good way to make the cages "hold" heat better, and also insulate them somewhat in case the room in which the cage was located got extremely hot (warm summer day or something). And (I think) fiberglass insulation is fireproof, so that can't hurt, either...not that it would prevent a fire, but at least it wouldn't be as likely to catch on fire, you know?

I'd love to hear any feedback on that idea, if anyone has experience with insulating their cages....gonna go check kingsnake.com right now.

[surfimp]

Okay, well, I've much to report.

Firstly, I tried using 1" Styrofoam to insulate the cage, by covering the exterior sides, back, and top of the enclosure. Here's a picture of the results:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/ugly01.jpg

In addition to being very, very ugly, I found that the Styrofoam really didn't seem to do much as far as heat retention goes. In fact, I couldn't really tell the difference at all. To be fair, I'll really need to do some more experimenting with it before I make a final judgement, but in the meantime I'm working on some other theories that may (hopefully) negate the need to use the insulation at all.

Which brings me to my next image, the picture of the new heating setup I'm using for the cage. I don't have sustained temperatures yet as I've only just set everything up. Anyways, here goes:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/heating02.jpg

I came to the realization today that I was fighting nature somewhat with my first setup. I had the most powerful heater in the highest and farthest back corner of the cage, where it was not really being used to it's greatest potential. I also had the weaker (and somewhat less confidence-inspiring) dual human heat pads down below, which worked out okay but didn't really manage to spread their heat to the cool side of the lower floor, which was kind of a pain.

Of course, the big "Oh, Duh!" point that I was missing was that heat rises. So that brought me to the setup you see above. I've pulled out the human heat pads for the moment and am trying out the radiant heat panel down below the shelf (still in the back corner), with my piece of 11" wide x 24" long Flexwatt about 2" from the front edge of the cage. This effectively creates a staggered heating setup, but provides basically the same amount of lower-floor heating coverage as the two 12" x 24" human heat pads I had underneath there before.

What I'm banking on with this setup is that the heat will rise up to the upper shelf and create a sufficient temperature up there for the snake to be happy. Before, I was dead-set on trying to create two warm -> cool gradients, one up on the shelf and one down below, but I've realized that the snake really only needs one "hot spot" available in order for proper digestion to take place. Hence the focus on the lower left corner of the cage.

Theoretically, this setup is going to basically warm the entire lower left half of the cage to an approximate surface temperature of 90 - 91 F, and from there I'm hoping that the heat will spread out and rise so that the lower right corner of the cage will be around 80 - 82 F and the upper shelf will be around 84 - 86 F. But this is all just theory at this point.

I've currently got my Helix's probe set on the floor of the cage, directly below the middle of the radiant heat panel. This location will of course have to be changed before I actually put a snake into the cage! I have the thermostat set on 90 F for this test.

The big concern I have is whether or not this setup will work through the night and maintain at least a 78 F background temperature. I really doubt it.

The reason I'm going to all the trouble of basically starting over with my cage heating setup is because I've realized that my home office is not gonna be able to be 80 F all the time, and have me in here working. That ain't gonna happen. So I've got to go to the cage and see what I can do there, in an effort to create a mammal/reptile cohabitation.

Any feedback ya'll have got would be much appreciated! If you think having basically 1/2 the floor of the cage at 90 F is unsafe and runs the risk of cooking the snake, please let me know! Thanks!  

[surfimp]

Oh, and regarding the problem that I thought I was having with the Flexwatt before--I think maybe I wasn't giving it long enough to heat up, or how I had my thermostat probe setup in conjunction with the radiant heat panel kept me from realizing just how warm it could get. Seems to be working fine now, especially since I can now measure surface temps with my Raytek temp gun ;)

[surfimp]

Well, my theory on this setup appears to have been pretty accurate, although it took some probe and thermostat set temperature adjustment to make it happen. Specifically, I moved the probe up onto the wall underneath the radiant heater, and I lowered the temperature setting on the thermostat down to 85 F...which was relieving, after having it set at 92 F in the original setup.

One thing I realized is that probe location is VERY important, and definitely takes some fiddling with to get it "right". I'm still not sure if I've got mine setup correctly or not, but I guess only time will tell.

Here's where I've got the probe located, currently. You can also see the gradient I've got going on the lower floor:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/probe.jpg

NOTE: The tinfoil tape is just temporary while I try this setup out--I will not be using it to mount the radiant heat panel permanently! I've got bolts and stuff for that.

Here's the nice 90 F surface temperature as reported by my trusty Raytek MiniTemp. This surface temp is consistent for basically the entire lower left hand corner of the cage.

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/surfacetemp.jpg

All of this stuff results in the following, which is what my temps are reading currently:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/heating03.jpg

I'm liking this setup better than my original one, because I feel that the original one was probably running a little too hot. I feel better with keeping my warmest surface temp at about 90 F, and with this new heating setup and the 76 F background room temperature, I can get decent temps throughout the cage without running such a risk of "cooking" the snake.

What all this experimenting keeps teaching me over and over again is how much your background room temperature really controls the ambient (cold side) air temperature in your cage. You can have 2 feet of Flexwatt and have a "perfect" warm side temperature, but literally 6" away from the end of the tape it's going to only be, at best, about 3-5 degrees above what your room's ambient air temperature is. At least in my cage it seems that way.

[surfimp]

Just wanted to follow up regarding the above photos. You can see that I used that tinfoil tape to hold up the radiant heat panel for testing purposes.

BAD IDEA!

I knew it wasn't really smart, but it "seemed so rock solid"...anyways, nothing burned down or caught on fire or even got melted, but it sure could have. I woke up this morning to the sound of a muffled "whump" and I said, "Oh %&^*$#@~...what's going on?"

When I checked on my cage about 5 seconds later, the radiant heat panel was face down on top of the newspaper that I have lining the bottom of the cage. It'd only been like that for a few seconds, but I wondered how long it would take for something really bad to happen if I hadn't heard it fall down. Glad I didn't have to find out!!!

For someone so concerned about fire safety, I seem to be making my life a little more difficult than necessary, no?

Anyways, be safe. If you need to do mockups with your heating equipment, just remember that you can always fix the little test mounting holes with something--and if the setup you're trying works out, then it's already done! Much better to have that, than to burn your whole house or cage down because you were too lazy to do it right.

[surfimp]

Are we there yet?

Geezuz, I've been working on this cage for a long time now! It seems like forever! But it's all going to be worth it in the end.

My most recent (and I think last) modification to my cage: a vinyl-coated mesh guard for the radiant heat panel. Here's a really bad photo that illustrates the idea:

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/panel_guard.jpg

In using my Raytek temp gun, I noticed that at times (i.e. under full power), the Helix Controls radiant heat panel's surface temperature was getting really high--like up to 185 F. That sort of freaked me out, so I went out and got some vinyl-coated wire to form a little guard between the snake and the face of the panel.

It works pretty well, because even the small (about 1/2" or so) gap allows enough distance that the wire mesh doesn't get too hot. I'm definitely glad that I used vinyl-coated (even though it was kind of a pain to find) because I'm sure that the regular galvanized stuff would've gotten pretty darn hot, thereby defeating the purpose of building the guard. The vinyl stuff should last longer in the high humidity environment, as well.

The best thing about the guard is that I actually got to put the extra 1/2" or so of threaded bolt left over from mounting the panel to good use--I simply got some big fender washers to hold the wire in place, and it worked out great.

Also, I found that I need to support the middle part of the mesh so that there'd be no way the snake could somehow bend down the middle section and then crawl in there, getting trapped in between the mesh and the face of the heat panel. I solved this problem by running some of the straight wire that came with my roll of mesh up and over the top of the panel, then attaching it to both sides in two locations in between the main bolts. This seems to work great and is very secure.

I also put a little secondary guard on the right hand side of the panel, so that there'd be no way the snake could fold down that side and get trapped in a similar fashion. On the far end, there's hopefully not enough space (only about 3/4" clearance) for the snake to get it's head in between the guard, the panel and the wall of the cage for this to happen. I hope!!!

Anyways, thank the Great Serpent that the snake is coming on Tuesday from Professor Ronne so that I can finally start enjoying the fruits of my labors! :)

[surfimp]

Just wanted to add, for anyone building similar wire-mesh guards for heat panels, incadescent bulbs, CHEs, or whatever, that I used 23 guage wire. Oh, and the technical name for this material is "vinyl coated hardware mesh"--it's usually located in with the fencing materials.

23 guage wire like the kind I used above is pretty thin and flexible, and has a square weave with 1/2" gaps. It's nice in that it's easy to bend to shape, but on the downside it's definitely weak enough that a big snake could bend it around if it so desired. For that reason you've got to brace or support it more.

Since my cage had to be baby- & adult-boa "proof", I went for this smaller gauge wire because I figured the square pattern would better keep a little neonate head away from the heat panel. If I only had to build this for a larger snake, I would've definitely used a heavier guage wire (like 15 or 16...they are listed in inverse proportional order, like shotgun guages). Usually the heavier gauge wire forms a rectangular weave that has a 1 : 3 or 1 : 4 width to length ratio.

I wasn't able to find any cage clips (or "J-Clips" as they're also known) or cage clip pliers, but those would help quite a bit for building a more structured (and aesthetically pleasing) mesh enclosure. Basically, it allows you to connect a number of pieces of flat mesh into a square or rectangular shape. Anyone whose ever built a rabbit hutch or bird cage (or fish/crab/lobster trap) probably knows what I'm talking about. I know that Hav-A-Hart makes both cage clips and cage clip pliers.

Hope that helps!

[surfimp]

More fun with that darn heat panel:

Naughty, naughty, naughty!

http://www.stevelange.net/boa/images/naughty.jpg

Well, I didn't like that at all, so for now I've removed the radiant heat panel and replaced it with a human heat pad underneath the enclosure. I've also removed any stray bits of duct tape I had stupidly put in the cage in order to hold wires down, etc., as there's no way in heck that I want to risk her getting tangled up in that stuff.

I've also received my Helix Controls 1500 watt system, which I'm using to control a Lakewood oil-filled radiator style space heater, which I'm using to heat the entire room that the snake enclosure is housed in. It's going to take a little doing to make sure that the thermostat/heater combo keeps the room at the right temperature overnight, but I'm confident that it'll work out just fine.

I feel much better now that I've gotten all wires, duct tape, and potentially harmful hiding spots out of my cage. I think I prefer having all that equipment outside the cage, for sure.

[morti]

That is SOoo cute! The snake is looking at the camera like "Who? Meeee?"

-Morti.