some help, please....

[Jonathan_Brady]

Sorry if this doesn’t make much sense.  I haven’t had any experience with this so I am trying to word this the best I can.
I am planning on purchasing a couple of the Boaphile’s 4’x2’x1’ drastic plastic cages.  For those who don’t know, these aren’t like his standard cages without the recess in the bottom for a heating pad, all sides are flush.  To see more about them to aid me in a decision, go here: http://www.boaphileplastics.com/drastic.html  What I would like to do with these cages is stack them 3 or 4 high and use heat tape (flexwatt, mylar, whatever) to heat them.  My question is this, should I run one strip of heat tape down one side of the cages (from top to bottom, left or right side), or down the back on one end, or should I get a 2’ section of 11” tape for each cage and run it from front to back along one of the ends (left or right) since the 11” is roughly equal to the height?
I ask because I am wondering how I would regulate the temperature.  If I use a proportional thermostat, wont the heat rise and heat all the cages unevenly (regardless of whether I use one piece of heat tape for all cages, or a piece for each cage?  If I put the temp probe in the bottom cage, the top cage may overheat because of the cage radiating heat upwards through each successive cage.  If I put it in the top, the bottom cage may be too cool for the same reason.  I am favoring the other method which is using one 2’ piece of 11” heat tape per cage (running along the left or right side, from front to back) and either a dimmer switch or an electronic thermostat like this:
http://www.bigappleherp.com/bigappleherp.filereader?3cc2d83e002733f4271d424
d361a
0623+EN/products/924100 for each cage.  Would this be an efficient and safe way to go?  Or would another method be preferred?
I’m not really sure what other questions I should be asking if any, but advice from anyone and everyone would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks for your time,
Jonathan Brady

[Kevin_Stoltz]

I have the same question...Ant help out there?

[Chad_Youngquist]

I don't have any boaphile plastics, but I'll tell you how I heat my cages. You may have seen a couple examples of what I build in previous posts here. They are single units with multiple levels of caging. Much like a situation you would have if you stacked a bunch of drastic plastic cages.

I use 11" heat tape and I usually run one strip down one side from top to bottom. Then, starting at the same end, I run a couple strips down the back adjacent to each other (this creates a warm corner). I fire up the thermostat and see how that hot and cool sides are doing. If the cool side is too cool, I add another strip of heat tape adjacent to the last one. Doing this for single units stacked on top of each other works well. Sometimes the bottom cage is cooler than the rest, so an under tank heater is good for the bottom only. The warm air inside the tanks usually heats the tank floor above fairly well. I think Jeff usually sandwiches two pieces of plastic together with heat tape inside to prevent heat loss out the back. I use double stick tape on the back of the enclosure and stick 1" insulating foam to the back of the setup.

On the one enclosure I built for the pet store (see previous post), this heating mehod doesn't work. In this case, I covered the entire back of the unit with heat tape and let the cool side be the front of the enclosure.

I've found that trial and error is the best method with heat tape. It will vary on room temp, and insulation. Every enclosure or setup is different.

Feel free to e-mail me with questions.

Chad Youngquist

[surfimp]

I've also found that trial and error, unfortunately, is the course du jour when it comes to setting up cages, and I have nowhere near the experience with the art that my esteemed colleague Prof. Youngquist has.

That said, I think you're right on with your concerns regarding temperature control. For what it's worth, I'm am completely sold on the pulse proportional thermostats sold by Helix Controls. The DBS-1000 is rated at 500 watts and should have enough power to run a small stack like you're talking about (probably three to five pieces of Flexwatt about 4 feet long or so, from the sounds of it).

According to Jeff from Helix Controls (and I think Mr. Ronne concurred with this, if I recall correctly), the 11" wide Flexwatt runs 20 watts per foot. So assuming you ran one strip in between your two columns of cages and two strips down the backsides of each column (and that might be more heat than you'd find you needed), you'd be pulling approximately 4' feet x 20 watt per foot = 80 watts per strip x 5 strips = 400 watts total, well under the 500 watt max for a DBS-1000.

And here's why I like the DBS-1000 better than Big Apple Herp's "Herp Power" thermostat:

a) the DBS-1000 is rated at 500 watts, vs. 300 watts for the Herp Power

b) the DBS-1000 has a digital thermometer with readout incorporated into it; the Herp Power does not and requires the use of a separate thermometer to measure temperature

c) the DBS-1000 only costs $20 more, and seems worth it in light of a) and b) above

Okay, now as regards probe placement vs. heat element setup: I don't think you have to worry too much about the top cage getting too warm. After all, you don't have direct airflow from the bottom cages all the way up to the top, you'll only get some indirect through-the-floor heating. Probably the bigger source of warmth for the top cages will be the natural heat gradient in the room, in which only two feet of height can make for a 2 F+ temperature difference.

That said, also remember that your Flexwatt, no matter how you set it up, will heat pretty consistently across it's length. There's a couple warmer spots here and there, but for the most part you'll get fairly even heat output, at least in my experience. Much more so, at least, than with human heat pads, again in my experience. So you should theoretically be getting the same amount of heat to your bottom cages that you are to your top cages, and thus if you put your probe in the top cage you should, theoretically, be ok, with the lower cages keeping the same (or very nearly the same) temperature as your top cages.

My last thought is that you'll definitely want to look at moving the air in your snake room around, so as to prevent creating a really strong vertical temperature gradient. I think a small fan that will create a circulating, top-to-bottom airflow should work okay, the goal being that the air temperature from floor to ceiling is as consistent as possible. This will also help maintain all your cages at a more consistent termperature.

But like Prof. Youngquist said, it's going to be some trial and error! Good luck, and please let us know what you do for a solution.

[Jonathan_Brady]

thanks for the advice guys, looking forward to seeing what i can work out when the time comes to order the cages.
later,
jonathan brady

[Darren_Hamill]

I use a 1' strip of 11" Flex Watt on each of my 4'cages. It provides enough heat for the ambient temperature to remain at 82 F and the hot spot is kept at 88 F. I use the Helix Basic to heat all of the Flex Watt for both cages and racks.

The probe is glued directly on top of the heat pad from the inside of the cage, (under the newspaper) therefore providing a very accurate temperature of the hot spot itself. In the case of the Rubbermaid racks, the probe is glued right onto the Flex Watt with a glue gun. I glue it in one of the corners of the rack where the Rubbermaid’s will never come in contact with the probe.

Hope this helps,